Rant (spoiler warning for 3X08)

[sams1ra]

I miss season 1.

I really do.

Season 2 had some good episodes, but... Just...

I hate stupid Dean. He doesn't know about Mary Poppins? Come on! Just like the fairy tales stuff. He didn't live in a cave for his entire childhood, the kid went to school, and there's no way he wouldn't know these things.
And about the Christmas lore. Pah-lease. I'm Jewish, and I know that it's based in Pagan mythology. I mean, the tree! It has Ashtoreth written all over it. *eyeroll*
And what were they thinking, using that kid from Something Wicked again? He sucked then, and he still sucks now. It made wee!Dean look like a jerk.
About the necklace. Yep. That's it. I gave up. Ridley was right. Sam gave it to Dean for Christmas. So no, Caleb didn't help him get it, "Uncle Bobby" did. But still. No longer obsessed with it, or with SN.
Which is kinda sad, I think, cuz I really liked it.
But they casted Ben, they couldn't find a kid with actual facial expressions to play wee!Dean? Wee!Sam was perfect (again)... *sigh*
Also, what happened to all their other connections? Season 1 had Caleb, Pastor Jim, and Joshua. Season 2 had Ellen. Why is it only Bobby now? Don't get me wrong, I love bobby (please don't kill him), but it's starting to feel like too much of a pattern. The boys get in trouble, they call Bobby, he calls them idiots, fixes the problem. Yay Bobby.
It's getting tired. Mix it up a little.
And talk about missed opportunities. Pagan gods taking Sam's (AntiChrist Jr.) blood, and nothing happens? They mix it with Dean's, and still nothing? Not even a flinch or a 'something's not right'? Dude.
So... I dunno.
I miss getting all excited about episodes. I just don't really get that lately, and it's kinda sad.
So here's yet another episode everyone else loved, and I just... didn't.
I'm beginning to like the fics better than the show, and that's just wrong. I used to get all jazzed up about Thursday. I used to wait till 4 AM to get to watch the episode. Now I have it, and I wait till I have time to watch it. I don't watch it the second I get it. It's kinda sad, for me.
Bring back the thrill. The SamnDean. I mean, season 1 had its bad episodes, I know, but every week was a rush. I miss that. I really do.
Also, I miss the cliffies, but since they don't really deliver lately... *shrug*
I did mention this was a rant, right?

Happy Christmas.

Comments

[janglyjewels.livejournal.com]

My husband is 43, been to Disney World about 7 times, and he still would not be able to tell you anything about Mary Poppins, especially who was in it. So, I can totally see Dean not knowing.

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

You know, maybe, but Snow White?
I miss smart!Dean. Like the one from Sin City. That was cool. Those writings made me LOL, but it was still cool.

[janglyjewels.livejournal.com]

I totally agree with you on the Snow White thing. There's no way Dean wouldn't know who Snow White was.

[pinkphoenix1985.livejournal.com]

you are Jewish? :D so am I :)
I agree with you on some of the points- but I did like the ep in general

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Ooh, good. Someone I can ask. Wouldn't you want to see some Jewish lore on the show? I mean, so far, we've had Christian, Buddhist, Tibetan, Irish, Pagan and many others, but not so much Jewish. Except for the Hebrew letters they use on the demon traps that just... so, so funny!

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Dude, your icon. GUH! *loves*

[pinkphoenix1985.livejournal.com]

*g* yeah I would love to see more Jewish lore! heck, they even used Arabic lore! They have used some hebrew in the show (besides the DTs)

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

*is thinking*
Really? When? I think I'd remember that... Hmm...

[pinkphoenix1985.livejournal.com]

LOL dont worry about it ;) They only used a couple of words and the pronunciation was totally off. A friend had to point them out to me :D

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

No, seriously, when?
Cuz the only thing I remember is the DT (meaningless letters), and the trap Dean used in Sin City, which spelled actual words, but I don't remember them saying stuff. Accept, I guess, Purim?

[pinkphoenix1985.livejournal.com]

well, yeah there was the Happy Purim, there was also the mazal tov that Dean said to Jo in No Exit as well as Sam saying Daver in Croaton. Daver in Hebrew means a insert plague. Also The DT isnt meaningless letters rather we dont mention it because it is really powerful words and stuff (and no I cant tell you why exactly *shrugs*)

[pinkphoenix1985.livejournal.com]

oops sorry misspelt insect *blush*

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Well, unless they changed Hebrew lately, these words are meaningless. (Eh, did I mention I speak Hebrew? hee)
But yeah, it's time for some Jewish lore. Bring it on! ;)

[pinkphoenix1985.livejournal.com]

I think that it is ancient hebrew...but obviously they had to change things- to make it more hollywood and such, but a DT does really exist and well it is used for other things... From what I understood- the real DT is something really dangerous since it conjures spirits, etc. LOL dont try it at home *g*

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

sawwy

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Hey, you deleted the comment, and I wanted to reply anyway.
First - GUH! Man, that icon! *melts into tiny puddles of goo*
Second, I admit that I'm a mythology buff. Has been for ages. But the Winchesters? They're not normal. Mythology to them is like Disney to normal. There's some stuff they should just know, and I'm tired of it being Sam explaining to Dean instead of, maybe, just reminding him and having Dean explain it. I hate Stupid!Dean, and I cannot say that enough.
Don't apologize, I like to hear what people think, or I wouldn't post things. You're entitled to your own opinions, and hey, sometimes people do point out things I didn't think about.
But.
Season 1, Asylum, I think, had Dean calling Joshua. He didn't die. And we never heard from him again. I don't remember who Dean called in Shadow, but it wasn't Bobby, and I don't think it was Caleb, either.
We had that guy in Sin City - someone who hunted with Dean. I squeed so hard at that. FINALLY! At least a couple of years, and yes, he has made connections.
About the family fluff: I think it was Carol Davis that said we finally had proof that John wasn't that bad a father. Yeah, yay for flashbacks, but did they have to use that kid again? *sniff*
Oh, and the blood - yeah, you're right. But they haven't mixed blood since Sam... err... fell on pie. So that would've been interesting.
I do hope you comment back. I'll even post a smilie for you ;)

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

Erm, now I don't remember which icon I used...I hate when that happens. I mostly deleted that other comment, cuz I was at work and feeling guilty and didn't have enough time to edit out the parts I didn't want to be quoted on, but I meant all of it.

We know Sam does the research. It's his thing, and he was working out as they went, here, too. He had books and laptop open throughout the epi, was doing the thumbnail bite, so it wasn't the type of thing that either of them just knew. And it shouldn't have surprised anyone that he was the one willing to buckle down and do the research. That's what he does.

Dean didn't look dumb at all. He just wasn't reading the books. Reading over little brothers' shoulders is rude. LOL. He pulls plenty of stuff out of his ear over the course of hunts, has a more peripheral intelligence, and it would be awkward to have him showing up Sam on mythology unless it pertained to something he'd hunted and Sam hadn't.

And I don't mind if they only ever call Bobby. They still have that whole stigma attached to them, because John gave YED the key to open the gate. They don't know who their friends are, but they know some people blame them for the gate opening and some still think Sam is one of the things they need to be hunting. I think it's wise to call on old faithful and let him help them out.

The whole idea that they have this huge support system in place has always felt and read like crap to me. Their isolation is what makes them so in tuned to each other. If they had so many other people to rely on, then their relationship wouldn't be as strong as it is. I like them going to each other, not calling up one of a bunch of other people who supposedly "get" them.

And we don't know they haven't mixed blood since then. I mean, they were both bleeding at the end of Fresh Blood, and I can't imagine they didn't get any on each other. I think if TPTB wrote it into an episode that they accidentally mixed blood and then something whammy happened, they'd be eating a lot of crow trying to explain how it is the get bloodied up all the time and never did it before.

And yeah, I didn't like that kid the first time either, and not much better this time, but he did have some of the mannerisms. Hard for a kid that age who has no real connection to the character. My biggest qualm with him is his looks, and apieceofcake posted a header that had both Dean and the kid on it, and it was kinda scary how much alike they looked. Hmmm...

I've had issues with lots of things this season, but it's things here and there, not the whole show or a whole epi, though Sin City was pretty pointless as far as I'm concerned. LOL.

Anyway, show is made of win. *pets my broken boys*

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

*stares*
*stares*
Oh. Eh, this is the icon you used. *stares some more*
Not gonna argue on the most part. You liked the epi, and I'm glad you did. I enjoyed an episode or two that people hated. We're all entitled to our own opinions.
I did feel like they're back on to stupid!Dean, and I really can't stand the kid, but wee!sammy? was awesome.
"Their isolation is what makes them so in tuned to each other. If they had so many other people to rely on, then their relationship wouldn't be as strong as it is."
You know? I think that's what I'm missing. Season 1 had more of that, I think. Just SamnDean looking for Dad, killing baddies on the way. But it was SamnDean getting to know each other again. I think that's what I'm missing.
So far this season, we've had quite a few "discoveries", but nothing deeper than 'yeah, I did that while you were in school' or 'remember that time when...'
I guess it leaves me wanting more. But that necklace? Yeah...
Totally a letdown. You might not think so, and others may agree, and that's ok. But we've been sorta kept guessing for 2.5 seasons, and now this? It's sorta like 'Dean, what did Dad say?' at the end of Croatoan. At least that's how I feel. Should have left it at shiny. *shrugs*
Anyway, I promised smilies!



Hope you can see those ;)

[historylover29.livejournal.com]

OK, here are my answers to your rant. And, I realize that it was a rant. And, you might not like what I have to say.

1) Dean not having watched Mary Poppins doesn't bother me much. If he never really had a childhood, he probably didn't watch it. Just because he went to school doesn't mean he necessarily would have watched that movie. He also doesn't strike me as the kind to watch those kind of fantasy movies or musicals. Or really even Disney movies much.

2)What is Ashtoreth? And many Americans don't know that most Christmas traditions are pagan in origin. Yeah, Dean should have known, but Sam also gets it wrong that Jesus was born in the Fall. Most likely, Jesus was born in the Spring, because that's when shepherds would be watching their flocks in the fields at night.

3) I didn't mind the kid in Something Wicked. I really didn't like Wee!Sam in Something Wicked. Plus, when you're 12, you're gonna be a jerk. It's a natural law.

4)I also called Sam giving Dean the amulet for Christmas. I even got their ages correct! Or do you forget my own writing (j/k) Although I had a few issues of how it was handled (Sam gave Dean a leftover gift?), I still liked it. Plus, Sam probably didn't know what the amulet really means. If it means anything.
But, yeah, fans have attached too much value, too much value, too much speculation on the amulet. Obviously. Jensen picked it out because he liked the looks of it, and Kripke off-handedly said that they'd come up with a backstory. That's hardly a promise.

5)If I'm reading you writing, because you're not happy with the way Kripke handled the amulet story means you're not coming back to the show? Alrighty.

6)Again, I never minded Wee!Dean in Something Wicked. Really didn't like sluggish Wee!Sam in Something Wicked. So, I have no problems with the kid playing Dean again.

7) I completely agree with the connections. I miss Ellen. Not that Bobby doesn't rock, because I so love Bobby. But, they had other people growing up. And they have Ellen now. But, hey, them going to Bobby is worlds better than them going to Bela!

8) I really don't like Sam being the Anti-Christ, so I have no problems with nothing happening when they cut Sam. Plus, I think that you going into that storyline (mixing the blood) takes this standalone into a direction that not many people like.

9)I don't think the cliffies ever really delivered, and I'm very glad this episode didn't end with the big reveal that wasn't. Season 1 had the cliffie of John calling and what was the big reveal? That they're in danger and he doesn't want the guys to go after him. And the big reveal in season 2? Sam may be evil and Dean may have to kill him? Please. So, I'm glad this had no big reveal that wasn't.
I will admit this season hasn't been what I was wanting. The only two episodes I've really liked this season have been Fresh Blood and this one. I mean, this season has brought us Bela and a much lighter tone. My feelings about Bela have not been a secret. And, I'm missing the darker tone. Plus, they're at war. What's with all the comedy?

10) It sounds to me like you're just looking for things to dislike about Supernatural. Maybe you don't like it as much as you thought you did. As far as the rush of season 1, to me, season 1 started off painfully slow. I can barely watch some of those episodes on DVD. Very hit and miss. Supernatural really didn't find its legs until Asylum. I loved season 2. A lot more good or great episodes than duds.

I just thought this was a fun episode. Not to be take too seriously. Like so many of the other episodes this season.

Have a Happy Hanukkah.

Kat

[historylover29.livejournal.com]

Double post, but I would love for them to do Jewish lore! I'd so love to see that!

Isn't a gollum part of Jewish lore?

Kat

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

NOpe, but I do see the hole in the page where they're supposed to be. LOL.

And yeah, I was spoiled on the necklace. I told you Tracer sends me the sides, so I knew about that months ago. But I seized on that little bit of info about Bobby getting it to give to John. That means it's important and doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't intended for Dean.

And you're right to a degree that they're not getting to know each other the same way as they did in the first season. I was gonna say something about this earlier, but I didn't. But I think it was Raelle Tucker who said that Supernatural is the Epic Love story of Sam and Dean. They're at that point in the love story where they're well and truly together on most things, the boy meets girl, hot and heavy part of the relationship where they finish each other's sentences and are smishably cute when they do.

The next part of any good love story, though, is the boy loses girl part. Between the threat of evil!Sammy putting in an appearance and Dean heading for Hell, they're definitely heading for a time when they're NOT together and not in tune to each other. That leaves us with the nummy Boy gets girl back part of the story, where everything we got in season one is rebuilt better and stronger than ever. But we have to make it that far, ya know?

I gotta keep my fingers crossed. *nods*

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Whoa, girl!
I'll answer, but in a different order.
First and foremost:
"If I'm reading you writing, because you're not happy with the way Kripke handled the amulet story means you're not coming back to the show? Alrighty."
You totally misunderstood me.
RL has really been kicking me for the past few months. I think you know at least some of it. I've been depressed for months now. SPN has, on occasion, helped make things better. But not for a while. And I think this episode made me stop expecting it would.
If I just watched this epi in order to entertain myself and pass 45 minutes, it's an ok episode. But if I'm looking for more than that, it didn't deliver. Not for me, anyway.
I'm not leaving Show. I love Show. It just used to be more for me, and it hasn't delivered in a long time. It used to, I guess that's part of the disappointment.
#1 - yeah, ok, fine. Not argueing about it anymore.
#2 - Ashtoreth is a goddess in Biblical times, used to be worshipped by worshipping a tree, not unlike the Christmas tree. And I still say the Winchesters are not normal and they should know that.
#4 - Remember I said they'd end up saying it was just shiny and he liked it? That's what this "big reveal" felt like. Yeah, I'm disappointed, and no, I don't care if there's any more meaning behind it. I'm done obsessing about it.
#7 - Glad we agree on something ;) Hasn't Dean made any connecions of his own? Ever? (poor Dean)
#8 - I get that. I do. I still think there could have been something more to be explored later. But that's just me.
#9 - I love cliffies. You know that by now. The crueler the better, imo. Yeah, Show hasn't really delivered, but I love my cliffies...
#10 - back to #5. I'm not looking for things to dislike about Show. Just saying it used to give me a rush and it doesn't lately. I agree, season 3 should have been darker. More intense. I guess they get better ratings on comedy or something. *shrugs* I miss the action and the brotherly interactions. Fresh Blood had one of my fav. SamnDean moments, but they're so few and far between... *sigh*
"I just thought this was a fun episode. Not to be take too seriously. Like so many of the other episodes this season"
And I agree. I was just expecting more of Show. I'll stop doing that. It's a fun show. (and pretty! and snarky!)
It's also a Sammy show. Good thing I have fandom to help me with the Dean show ;)
And yeah, I'm in a bitchy mood. Have been for a while (like I said, RL is really mean to me lately). That's why I haven't been around the faNily much lately. I don't want to spread the bad mood. But I do need to rant sometimes. And this is what that was. A rant.

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Lol
Gollum is from LOTR. A Golem is part of Jewish lore. I wrote it in AtGS, but didn't go into all the details as not to distract from the story. Things kinda get lost in translation... ;)

[historylover29.livejournal.com]

Oops. Sorry! :)

Misspelled. I hate it when I do that!

Kat

[historylover29.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I know. RL sucks out loud for me too.

I understand, hon!

*hugs*

Again, sorry about the misspell. I feel so "D'oh" when I do that!

Kat

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

lol
I know, that's why I e-mailed them to you, too. =D
About the necklace, I really have given up on that. It has no deeper meaning, as far as I'm concerened. Just a brotherly thing. It would have made me go 'awwww' and quish wee!sam if I hadn't been waiting for 2.5 seasons to know what it is.
I get what you're saying about the love story thing.
I really think the reason for my bitchiness isn't Show at all. And, man, this post has gotten more comments than anything else I've ever posted. But what can I say? I was expecting more of Show.
It just shows how much I trusted Show.
I'm not expecting more anymore. (huh. weird sentence) Maybe that'll help me enjoy Show more, ya know? No more hidden meanings and overtones. Just an hour of pretty and snark.
Or maybe the universe will decide I've suffered enough, and RL will finally start to get better and make me less bitchy. *sigh*
Who knows?

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

lol That's ok. You made me smile on a Sunday.
Cookies to you!

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Yay, someone doesn't hate me for this post!
Hope RL gets better for you soon!

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

I think there are plenty of hidden meanings and undertones, we're just looking for them with our same old eyes and not looking in the right places. Also, we're looking for what we want to see, when what we get might actually be way better.

*kicks your shins and runs away*

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

OW!
I'm telling Kripke!
*sticks out tongue*

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

Haha, run and tell him. He's on my side. I have his autograph right here...course it kinda looks like Cici???

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

dude, he's totally spazz he has a fan from Israel, he'll automatically be on my side.
Plus, J2 will probably be there too, and I'll snag Jensen and sneak him over to my place. HA!

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

Haha, you're too late. The Js are in my underwear drawer... It's like the Lion, the Witch, and the Underwear drawer. It's the Sasquatch, the Hot Boy, and the Underwear drawer, whole other fantasy world in there...yup. *nods*

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

So, basically, you're just asking for a panty-raid, aren't you?
*is evol*
*and a geek*

[tru-faith-lost.livejournal.com]

Haha, no raiding is necessary. I think there's an altar with my panties flung over it and a shrine of leather and gun oil...ooooh yeah.

Okay, so I have no idea which icon I'm using. I'll edit it out if it's a nasty one, LOL.

ETA: I edited it anyways, because I spelled altar wrong. *facepalm*

[mtee.livejournal.com]

Wow - totally disagree with you.
And I think sometimes when you read too many fics (and let me say this - I read EVERYTHING I can get my hands on), your vision gets blurred. I am saying you start to expect things to happen on the actual show that happen in the fics. Your vision of what is true canon and will actually happen is off. We will never get all the whumping or the whole Triad thing on the show.

But if those scenarios are what you read over and over - then when the true show comes on - you will be disappointed. Very few authors stay with the true characterization of the boys. They will add their own biases or desires. So we read about a Sam and Dean that aren't truly the real characters. And that's ok - I love the stories, I read them daily. Heck, the actual writers have their own views of Sam and Dean and that's what we get on Thursday. And that's what is canon. I think you want the Sam and Dean of fanfic lore and that's not going to happen.

Mary Poppins - unless you went to see it at a theater, bought the DVD or managed to catch it on tv - and I'm not even sure it's been on- you wouldn't know. It's not like John would have read him books or bought Disney stuff. Dean was too into hunting and doing what John wanted -- Sam was open to other things - tried to be like the other kids - so I can see him knowing about it. Dean's world is very limited - he has tunnel vision in a way.

And to be truthful - Ellen has been the only other character, other than Bobby to be in several episodes. Once again fics have elevated Caleb and Pastor Jim to major characters - not the show. Personally, I can't even remember what episode even mentions Caleb. I know them from the fics - not from extensive mentions in the show. So I don't think that's a fair negative.

They have brought in new characters and I'm sorry, I don't mind them. Bela is quite interesting. Ruby needs work - but I can manage.

As for Sam/Dean - the last 2 eps have really given us some wonderful moments. Really emotional -- they've talked and opened up. You can't get better brotherly moments than Sam telling Dean he wants his big brother back. Or Dean telling Sam he wants Christmas because it's going to be his last. And those final scenes in the Christmas special - geez, that's angst out the behind!

I'm sorry you aren't into it. And more than likely nothing they do will get your excitement back. You seem to have tuned out. Now you will find things to get upset about more than you will like. It happens.

[sams1ra.livejournal.com]

Ya know, I have no problem with people disagreeing with me. This is MY opinion. And it hasn't changed.
Yeah, I read Ridley. I enjoy her stories. But she's far from being my favorite author.
Caleb was mentioned twice that I remember - in Asylum and in Salvation. There was Joshua there, too. Twice, I think, but that doesn't really matter.
They used one of Dean's contacts in Sin City. He had been hunting for a long time, I'm sure not ALL his contacts are John's. And that would be better than Bela or Ruby, at least imho.
I liked Gordon. I liked Ash. I liked Jo once she realized she had no chance with Dean - it gave the character an opening to grow up. I LOVED Andy. YED was a cool character. Sarah was fun, as was Missouri. They have succeeded in that before.
I enjoyed few of season 3's episodes. But I admit. I wanted this one to be less about Sam saving Dean and more about Dean needing to be saved. Note that it's a very thin line between them.
I already said fine about the Mary Poppins thing. I may disagree, but I accept it. I do not accept that he doesn't know the Grimm brother's story, or their origin.
To me, mythology is a hobby. They do that for a living. Dean hunted on his own and survived. I refuse to believe he doesn't know that stuff. We had a couple of episodes of smart!Dean. I want more. It's what I, personally, like. You may disagree, but that is my opinion.
Like Kat said, this season was supposed to be about the war. I don't know, supposed to be darker. It's not.
We do get awesome brotherly moments. If I knew how, I'd cut the 1.2 minutes of it from every episode and put them together for an awww-fest. But the dynamic has changed.
Note that in season 3, Dean is the only one without secrets. It's both surprising and refreshing to me. But they're not going there. The Mary plotline hasn't been mentioned in ages.
There hasn't been any real cliffies lately. And seriously, I wish they hadn't said anything about the necklace. It was a sweet moment, I agree. If it were revealed back in season 1. It might still have meaning to it, but I'm not holding my breath.
I don't like gore. I like suspense, I like angst, I love plot twists.
If you asked me what are my 5 favorite episodes, 4 of them will be from season 1. Maybe they're not the best, but they're the ones I've watched over a dozen times and never tire of. I want more of that.
And like I said before, if I was just looking for something to pass the time, I would have loved the episode. But I've come to expect more of Show. It used to deliver. I'm not saying season 1 was perfect, but I got a rush just thinking of Thursdays.
I miss that. That's all I'm saying. You might disagree, and I'm cool with that, but that's how I feel.